Hi all, I am trying to run my MotifXF6 into two Yamaha DRX powered speakers.
Its a live performance using one DRX as side fill and the other as my monitor.
No brand of cable, will get rid of the loud hum from the Motif.
Can anyone help me with a solution of creating balanced outputs from the MotifXF?  I tried a direct box, with some success, but lost at least 6db, and sounded thin. The transformer type of hum relief, really doesn’t fix the problem, just decouples the ground.  Still there is hum from the unbalanced outputs on the MotifXF.  Anyone run into a fix for this??
Thank You, Cary

Cary - 14 February 2014 10:28 AM

Hi all, I am trying to run my MotifXF6 into two Yamaha DRX powered speakers.
Its a live performance using one DRX as side fill and the other as my monitor.
No brand of cable, will get rid of the loud hum from the Motif.
Can anyone help me with a solution of creating balanced outputs from the MotifXF?  I tried a direct box, with some success, but lost at least 6db, and sounded thin. The transformer type of hum relief, really doesn’t fix the problem, just decouples the ground.  Still there is hum from the unbalanced outputs on the MotifXF.  Anyone run into a fix for this??
Thank You, Cary

Welcome to the forum.

Do you have a Motif XF6 or a MOXF6 (you posted in the MOXF forum)?

I assume you’re referring to Yamaha DXR speakers.

What kind (not brand) of cables, TS or TRS, are you using?

How long are they?

Where are the speakers getting power versus where the synth is plugged in - same outlet or not?

When you tried the direct box, what type of cables did you use?

If the direct box was outputting mic-level signal, did you set the DXR input to “mic” position?

5pinDIN - 14 February 2014 10:41 AM

Cary - 14 February 2014 10:28 AM

Hi all, I am trying to run my MotifXF6 into two Yamaha DRX powered speakers.
Its a live performance using one DRX as side fill and the other as my monitor.
No brand of cable, will get rid of the loud hum from the Motif.
Can anyone help me with a solution of creating balanced outputs from the MotifXF?  I tried a direct box, with some success, but lost at least 6db, and sounded thin. The transformer type of hum relief, really doesn’t fix the problem, just decouples the ground.  Still there is hum from the unbalanced outputs on the MotifXF.  Anyone run into a fix for this??
Thank You, Cary

Welcome to the forum.

Do you have a Motif XF6 or a MOXF6 (you posted in the MOXF forum)?
Sorry, my mistake. I have a MotifXF6
Can you move this into the MotifXF forum?

I assume you’re referring to Yamaha DXR speakers.
Yes, I bought two new Yamaha DRX-10 powered speakers.

What kind (not brand) of cables, TS or TRS, are you using?
I have tried TS, TRS, and adapted XLR through a DI, and a TRS to XLR

How long are they?
The cables ranged from 3’ 6’ 12’

Where are the speakers getting power versus where the synth is plugged in - same outlet or not?
The speakers are plugged into the same outlet as the MotifXF6

When you tried the direct box, what type of cables did you use?
I used all of the above cables I have.

If the direct box was outputting mic-level signal, did you set the DXR input to “mic” position?

Yes, I have tried all inputs, and yes I have tried the mic setting,line setting, disabling the DSP, and the HPF
Thank You for your help,
Cary

What happens if you run the XF through a mixer and into the #1 input with XLR cables? Thus: Unbalanced from XF into mixer, XLR from mixer to #1 (top) input of DXR set to line level.

I had the hum you speak of for the longest time. The only thing that cured it was buying a voltage regulator power conditioning supply for every piece of gear I use. Not 1 problem since. Normal power supplies won’t fix problems you don’t know you have with AC. I have a Furman AR-117. Best money you’ll spend. Doubles as headache reliever!

Cary - 14 February 2014 05:39 PM

5pinDIN - 14 February 2014 10:41 AM

Cary - 14 February 2014 10:28 AM

Hi all, I am trying to run my MotifXF6 into two Yamaha DRX powered speakers.
Its a live performance using one DRX as side fill and the other as my monitor.
No brand of cable, will get rid of the loud hum from the Motif.
Can anyone help me with a solution of creating balanced outputs from the MotifXF?  I tried a direct box, with some success, but lost at least 6db, and sounded thin. The transformer type of hum relief, really doesn’t fix the problem, just decouples the ground.  Still there is hum from the unbalanced outputs on the MotifXF.  Anyone run into a fix for this??
Thank You, Cary

Welcome to the forum.

Do you have a Motif XF6 or a MOXF6 (you posted in the MOXF forum)?
Sorry, my mistake. I have a MotifXF6
Can you move this into the MotifXF forum?

I assume you’re referring to Yamaha DXR speakers.
Yes, I bought two new Yamaha DRX-10 powered speakers.

What kind (not brand) of cables, TS or TRS, are you using?
I have tried TS, TRS, and adapted XLR through a DI, and a TRS to XLR

How long are they?
The cables ranged from 3’ 6’ 12’

Where are the speakers getting power versus where the synth is plugged in - same outlet or not?
The speakers are plugged into the same outlet as the MotifXF6

When you tried the direct box, what type of cables did you use?
I used all of the above cables I have.

If the direct box was outputting mic-level signal, did you set the DXR input to “mic” position?

Yes, I have tried all inputs, and yes I have tried the mic setting,line setting, disabling the DSP, and the HPF
Thank You for your help,
Cary

Proper cabling and a good quality direct box (DI) should be able to eliminate any hum that’s caused by unbalanced lines that are being exposed to reasonable EMI fields or due to ground loops. This assumes that your AC power is known to be good and that there’s no source of unusually high level EMI. A bad ground connection can cause hum problems, so trying another outlet might be worthwhile.

The cables from the XF to the DI should be TS type (unbalanced), and as short as possible. The balanced output cables from the DI should connect to the DXR speaker’s XLR connector - the phone jacks are unbalanced inputs. I’m not sure what you mean by “adapted XLR”, but I’d suggest that cables with proper connectors (not requiring adapters) be used. A passive DI should provide good isolation - however, an inexpensive one might have inadequate and/or poorly shielded transformers, and can sound “thin” (due to insufficient low frequency coupling) or induce hum (due to insufficient shielding).

By the way, other than the main L/MONO and R outputs and the power cord, do you have any other cables connected to the XF? Have you determined whether there’s any hum when listening with headphones when no other cables are attached to the XF?

stoneb3 - 14 February 2014 06:56 PM

What happens if you run the XF through a mixer and into the #1 input with XLR cables? Thus: Unbalanced from XF into mixer, XLR from mixer to #1 (top) input of DXR set to line level.

I’d be interested in the answer to my question. Very interested.

Is your USB plugged into your pc?

If you find (as I did) that there’s no hum at the phones output even when the cables are hooked up to the mixer and everythings on, a proper power source capable of really protecting your $1700+ investment (plus everything else you plug into it) is money well spent.

If you gig, there are AC landmines awaiting your arrival at a club near you. Digital gear is sensitive and finicky about what power you feed it. I have an Axe FX plugged into my supply that cost more than my MOXF. I bought the supply for it originally. Food for thought…

Cary - 14 February 2014 09:19 PM

stoneb3 - 14 February 2014 06:56 PM

What happens if you run the XF through a mixer and into the #1 input with XLR cables? Thus: Unbalanced from XF into mixer, XLR from mixer to #1 (top) input of DXR set to line level.

If you could tell me the mixer that would convert the unbalanced output from the MotifXF, to a balanced XLR out, I would buy it.

Cary

Here’s three solutions.

Ebtech Hum X Ground Loop Eliminator:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HumX/?utm_source=MSN&utm_medium=PPC&utm_campaign=livesound&utm_term=ebtech_hum_x

Ebtech Hum Eliminator for unbalanced cables:
http://www.zzounds.com/item--EBTHE2PKG

Radial ProD2 stereo passive DI, converts unbalanced 1/4” to XLR outs:
http://www.zzounds.com/item--RADPROD2

Thanks, you came back as I typed. Having never plugged directly into the speakers from the keyboard without a mixer, I tried it. Unbalanced cable out of Motif XS to unbalanced #2 input of DXR. Hum. Adjusted XS output to +0db, hum. I’m searching for an instrument that outputs -10db, may take a minute.

I’ve always used the DXR’s with a balanced XLR cable from the mixer to the #1 balanced XLR input of the DXR. I have used 2 Mackie LM3204’s, Mackie VLZ 3 1402,Yamaha MG console and MOTU 828mk2, none of which exhibit any noise when cabled in that manner. I have never previously used the other two inputs of the speakers. (The third input accepts RCA jacks). All devices on same conditioned line with Canare cabling of unquestionable fortitude. Class D amp in the DXR.

Stone

Radial Pro D2 provides a small measure of noise reduction, not enough. Will sub it out in the am. Sick with flu.

Hi 5pindin, I have quality cables(mogami)?, and the odd adapted is a trs to xlr.
I have nothing else plugged into, or out of the Motif, exc the power, and mono out.  Tried running stereo with the same result. The thing I don’t understand is the two different studio monitors I use have no hum.
Plug the same cable into the DXR’s and its LOUD.  Is the Motif is causing the hum, or the DXR’s making it apparent?  No studio monitors I tried have any 60 cycle noise that I can hear.  Is there a way to create balanced outputs in the Motif??  Are the DRX’s inducing the hum?? 
If you tell me that a certain DI is needed, so be it.  If a live mixer will do it, please tell me what it is, and I will get it.  I tried to get Yamaha to help me (their products, you know), but they have not called, or email back.  I feel like the company knows something, but the problem must be theirs, or they would reply, no?
I thank you all so much. No one has helped as much, and you all have jumped in to help. What a great community.
Thank you all,
Cary

jshep0102 - 14 February 2014 09:25 PM

Is your USB plugged into your pc?

If you find (as I did) that there’s no hum at the phones output even when the cables are hooked up to the mixer and everythings on, a proper power source capable of really protecting your $1700+ investment (plus everything else you plug into it) is money well spent.

If you gig, there are AC landmines awaiting your arrival at a club near you. Digital gear is sensitive and finicky about what power you feed it. I have an Axe FX plugged into my supply that cost more than my MOXF. I bought the supply for it originally. Food for thought…

Hi jshep0102, I use a power conditioner, but not yours.  If I knew that it would eliminate the hum, I would get one.  How do I know that the one you use would work??  I feel like I’m chasing this.  I don’t know what to do.
Thank you,
Cary

Hello Mr Dave Polich, Thank you for you time and reply.  I looked at your suggestions, and I thought the last one looked like a quality unit.
Then I read stoneb3’s reply, and he duplicated my hum!! 
Now that I know its not the Motif, but the DRX,s I know what the problem is.
In your experience, what product do I need?  #3 looks the best. What is your opinion, now knowing its the DRX,s not the MotifXF.
Thank you for your help,
Cary

I also have an XF8, and I am also running it (and two additional stereo keyboard sources...my slab piano and my Hammond Organ module) into a stereo pair of DXR10 speakers.

In the past I have had substantial ground loop issues...albeit before I owned the DXR10’s...and as Dave Polich posted, the Radial ProD2 stereo DI has given me amazing results for hum elimination...and I never even had to employ the ground lift switches!  It is a killer DI, and I still use it between my main keyboard mixer-out and FOH send signal.  Again, kills all ground hum.

What I am doing for my keyboard monitor mix now is using my Yamaha MG102c compact mixer, inputting the (3) stereo keyboard signals (and sending the main outs to the ProD2 and on to the FOH desk), and outputting (3) stereo keyboard monitor signals via the monitor send of the Yamaha MG102c.

I am using 15’ unbalanced TS cables from the monitor send of the Yamaha MG102c to the unbalanced inputs of the DXR10 channel (2) jacks (per a recommendation from 5pinDIN)...and then jumping stereo to my 2nd DXR10 via the Stereo Link provided using an XLR balanced cable.

I have zero hum in this set-up.  I know that all set-ups are unique, and I also know that 5pinDIN and others responding here have a lot more electrical and electronic knowledge than I, so am offering this only for what it is worth as my personal experience!