Hi!

I am wondering what the best way to make a mono-playable piano sound. I know about the preset Mono Piano voice, but am wondering if there is a better way. Would replacing the stereo elements of one of the piano voices with preset mono waveforms get me the result that I want? I want to be able to play realistic ragtime piano, with the piano sounding good through mono. If I have to, I WILL use the built in mono piano or one of the stereo piano sounds. My performance is this coming Sunday.

I am on a budget right now, and already spent a lot on my Motif since May, when I got it. Between the keyboard itself, it’s case, it’s stand, it’s speaker, and it’s accessories, I have spent a good deal, and can’t stomach another expensive purchase for a while. When I can, I will purchase a second amp so that I can perform in stereo (still awaiting recommendations on that one via another thread). Thanks!

-Max

On the MOXF, there is a setting called something like ‘voice elements stereo’ that makes the voice sound mono if switched off. Sorry for not being more precise but I am 200 miles away from the synth at the moment.
I often switch this off myself when I need to place voices in the mix.

EDIT. Back home and checked, this setting is not available in Voice mode, but it’s there in Performance, Song and Pattern.

Page 66 in the ref manual for MoXF, but I’m sure the setting will be there somewhere also for the Motif.

Well, now that Sunday is past, I still would like to know how do do this.

zpink: I need this type of thing in Voice Mode, as it is only for a single piano sound. Thanks, though.

-Max

There is certainly nothing prohibiting using a PERFORMANCE, SONG, or PATTERN for a single PART.

In fact, many people do just that for a variety of reasons.

Just looking for a temporary alternative.

I suspect that Yamaha wants voices to always be in stereo since they tend to sound better like that. Why not use performance?
To change the voice, you most likely will have to centre each element and it will be tricky to get it right if you ever want to go back to stereo again.

I just would rather leave what I have for live performances where I will need more than one voice. How would I center each element in a voice? Couldn’t I just save that voice as a user voice, and then use the regular voices when I can do stereo?

-Max

Mighty Motif Max - 20 September 2016 12:48 PM

How would I center each element in a voice?
-Max

With the editor if hooked up to a computer, if not, then with some patience. ;-)

I’m on a MoXF and also tend to use the editor for almost any tweaks I do. Another Motif user would be more suitable to help here, but since it’s the same engine....here goes:

(This is how it’s done on the MoXF!)
In voice mode, press Edit, this defaults to Common Edit, so press the first element button. Select the ‘AMP’ tab, and there’s your ‘Pan’, so centre that. Then do the same for each active element and save as user.

Have fun! ;-)

All of my elements were automatically centered already. It still sounds very canned. :-(

I tried creating a Performance, but could not find the correct settings to make it mono.

-Max

Mighty Motif Max - 30 September 2016 12:20 AM

All of my elements were automatically centered already. It still sounds very canned. :-(


I tried creating a Performance, but could not find the correct settings to make it mono.

-Max

You may need a small mixer (or maybe even just a Y-cable) to get your outputs down to a proper mono, rather than Left or Right channel.

With your piano voice, I assume that if you take the left channel, it’s more bass heavy and you’re losing out on the higher notes?

It is a bit strange that there’s no setting that lets one mix down both channels to a mono out on for instance Left.

The entire piano sound is very compressed and canned - not just the lows or highs. The mid-section is by far the worst.

Mixer recommendations? These were recommended to me on another thread: Yamaha MG06X

Mackie Mix8

Others?

-Max

Mixing stereo Waveforms to mono will cause phase cancellation, to a degree dependent on the samples involved, resulting in various anomalies. It doesn’t matter whether the mixing is done by using just the L/MONO output (with no plug in the R jack), panning everything to center in the XF, or with an external mixer. Even using the XF in stereo, but placing the two speakers in very close proximity to each other, can have a similar outcome.

A cohesive Mono piano sound is best obtained by using mono Waveforms. If for some reason that’s not possible, one approach is to use just the L output (with a plug in the R jack) or R output, and EQ to somewhat offset any frequency response imbalance.

5pinDIN-
Mixing stereo Waveforms to mono will cause phase cancellation, to a degree dependent on the samples involved, resulting in various anomalies. It doesn’t matter whether the mixing is done by using just the L/MONO output (with no plug in the R jack), panning everything to center in the XF, or with an external mixer. Even using the XF in stereo, but placing the two speakers in very close proximity to each other, can have a similar outcome.

A cohesive Mono piano sound is best obtained by using mono Waveforms. If for some reason that’s not possible, one approach is to use just the L output (with a plug in the R jack) or R output, and EQ to somewhat offset any frequency response imbalance.

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Mighty Motif Max - 16 September 2016 10:17 PM

Hi!


...Would replacing the stereo elements of one of the piano voices with preset mono waveforms get me the result that I want?…

I did this already, but the sound was barely different.

-Max

From your original post it’s not 100% clear, do you have a pair of monitors/speakers for home/studio use, and one amplifier that you use for playing gigs?
If so, does it sound ‘canny’ also if you’re playing through only one of your speakers?

Just to rule out that it’s not your amp rather than the fact that it’s mono causing the canny-ness.

Mighty Motif Max - 01 October 2016 03:38 PM

Mighty Motif Max - 16 September 2016 10:17 PM

Hi!

...Would replacing the stereo elements of one of the piano voices with preset mono waveforms get me the result that I want?…

I did this already, but the sound was barely different.

-Max

There’s more to a good mono Voice than would be accomplished by just replacing stereo Waveforms with mono ones.

How do the piano Voices (stereo and mono) sound to you on headphones?

zpink

From your original post it’s not 100% clear, do you have a pair of monitors/speakers for home/studio use, and one amplifier that you use for playing gigs?
If so, does it sound ‘canny’ also if you’re playing through only one of your speakers?

Just to rule out that it’s not your amp rather than the fact that it’s mono causing the canny-ness.

I have a single speaker. When I am at home, I plug the Left output into this speaker, and the Right output into my Yamaha Clavinova CVP-305’s Aux In port.

I only use the speaker when performing live, as I cannot bring along the Clavinova, for obvious reasons.

5pinDIN

How do the piano Voices (stereo and mono) sound to you on headphones?

The stereo piano sounds sound fine. The (user) mono piano sound sounds almost the same through the headphones as through the amp. The Preset mono piano sounds OK, but not great, through the headphones, but not through the amp.

-Max