This is a loooonnnngggg shot.  Just wondered if there was a site anywhere that had guides for setting up performances for a gigging keyboard player?

I’m resigned to having to do it myself, which is fine, but time is at a premium for me and if there was some site that had setup guides already done would be all sorts of magnificent!! :D

The cover band I’m in is primarily a corporate/wedding band so the setlist mainly consists of classics, rock and modern day chart music.

I came across a website called “cool webinars”.  Didn’t have much info on the site though and only has “uptown funk” and “we found love” on youtube.  But it’s this sort of idea only with a plethora of songs.

Some songs are already covered. Have you seen this?…
http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/viewthread/452022

stein67 - 07 May 2015 04:19 PM

This is a loooonnnngggg shot.  Just wondered if there was a site anywhere that had guides for setting up performances for a gigging keyboard player?

I’m resigned to having to do it myself, which is fine, but time is at a premium for me and if there was some site that had setup guides already done would be all sorts of magnificent!! :D

The cover band I’m in is primarily a corporate/wedding band so the setlist mainly consists of classics, rock and modern day chart music.

I came across a website called “cool webinars”.  Didn’t have much info on the site though and only has “uptown funk” and “we found love” on youtube.  But it’s this sort of idea only with a plethora of songs.

I suggest that you continue doing the programming yourself. While there are a couple of
80’sPopRock libraries available at the Shop that cover some of the classic hits, and the
library “Vintage Keys” by DCP productions contains some famous “synth” sounds for
classic rock, there are no sites elsewhere that provide Motif performances of hit songs.

Programming your sounds is part of your job as a keyboard player.You’ll always learn something new while doing it, and the better you get at it, the less time it will take, and
eventually you won’t have to go looking for the sounds you need because you will be able to make them yourself.

DavePolich - 07 May 2015 08:59 PM

stein67 - 07 May 2015 04:19 PM

This is a loooonnnngggg shot.  Just wondered if there was a site anywhere that had guides for setting up performances for a gigging keyboard player?

I’m resigned to having to do it myself, which is fine, but time is at a premium for me and if there was some site that had setup guides already done would be all sorts of magnificent!! :D

The cover band I’m in is primarily a corporate/wedding band so the setlist mainly consists of classics, rock and modern day chart music.

I came across a website called “cool webinars”.  Didn’t have much info on the site though and only has “uptown funk” and “we found love” on youtube.  But it’s this sort of idea only with a plethora of songs.

I suggest that you continue doing the programming yourself. While there are a couple of
80’sPopRock libraries available at the Shop that cover some of the classic hits, and the
library “Vintage Keys” by DCP productions contains some famous “synth” sounds for
classic rock, there are no sites elsewhere that provide Motif performances of hit songs.

Programming your sounds is part of your job as a keyboard player.You’ll always learn something new while doing it, and the better you get at it, the less time it will take, and
eventually you won’t have to go looking for the sounds you need because you will be able to make them yourself.

While programming your own sounds is allways fun and good to learn, there is also something called a community to help eachother..

Just tell me the difference between sharing other peoples music on stage and using pre programmed sounds?

I think having a community of people that share the things they have created freely ober the web would be a good thing. People helping eachother would be an even better thing. Now if you said, now let me help you with creating those sounds would be something different. But all you said is ....  Just do it yourself, and if you can’t you are a fail..

People not able to share, and asking money for everything they do, like creating guides or for sharing the stuff they made are the bane of todays community… In days long passed when minstrells and bards met on the road, they spend days together teaching eachother their songs and mellodies. Thats how music survived in those days, and thats what made musicians the core of the social society…

Many of us wandered off way to far from this road....

There is nothing wrong in sharing Dave.... Its a wonderfull thing knowing you have helped someone...and if you dont want to share your patches atleast tell him how to create his own patches…

lordbachus - 09 May 2015 11:42 PM

While programming your own sounds is allways fun and good to learn, there is also something called a community to help eachother..

[...]I think having a community of people that share the things they have created freely ober the web would be a good thing. People helping eachother would be an even better thing.[...]

There have been occasional efforts to “share” Motif sounds. Some offered legitimate original material, but others were at best slightly tweaked commercial libraries.

Anyone who has actually created a Motif Voice from “scratch” knows how many Parameters have to be adjusted in order to obtain the sound they’re aiming for. It can often take a considerable amount of time, and most people attach some value to that.

In an ideal world, sharing everything would be practical because everyone’s needs would be seen to and nobody would lack anything. Unfortunately, that’s not the way things are. The Motifator forums, which of course provide a means of sharing information, can exist because they’re supported by sales of products related to Motifs.

As you might have noticed, I’m a proponent of sharing. I’m also a realist.  See http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/index.php/viewforum/121/

5pinDIN - 10 May 2015 06:46 AM

lordbachus - 09 May 2015 11:42 PM

While programming your own sounds is allways fun and good to learn, there is also something called a community to help eachother..

[...]I think having a community of people that share the things they have created freely ober the web would be a good thing. People helping eachother would be an even better thing.[...]

There have been occasional efforts to “share” Motif sounds. Some offered legitimate original material, but others were at best slightly tweaked commercial libraries.

Anyone who has actually created a Motif Voice from “scratch” knows how many Parameters have to be adjusted in order to obtain the sound they’re aiming for. It can often take a considerable amount of time, and most people attach some value to that.

In an ideal world, sharing everything would be practical because everyone’s needs would be seen to and nobody would lack anything. Unfortunately, that’s not the way things are. The Motifator forums, which of course provide a means of sharing information, can exist because they’re supported by sales of products related to Motifs.

As you might have noticed, I’m a proponent of sharing. I’m also a realist.  See http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/index.php/viewforum/121/

I dont think a website like motifator requires the sales to make profit, as many other popular websites make money by adding advertismens alone.... Not that its a bad thing they are selling this stuff as overall most of the prices sound pretty fair.

I found some facebook pages that share some lovely stuff, however, i am wondering indeed how much stuff on there is illegally copied.  I was strictly talking about user created content from free sample libraries ( there are many high quallity ones). To patches and voices and arps that use the over 700 mb of content allready in the MOXF....

Still makes me feel a little sad, not being able to to share my selfcreated stuff with other likeminded…

lordbachus - 11 May 2015 02:58 AM

...I dont think a website like motifator requires the sales to make profit, as many other popular websites make money by adding advertismens alone.... Not that its a bad thing they are selling this stuff as overall most of the prices sound pretty fair....

There is nobody stopping people from sharing original VOICE or PERFORMANCE work at this Forum.

For example, you will find some excellent work offered Here.

However, if you think that this site does not need to sell products to keep it solvent and functioning, you might be interested in what MrMotif has to say Here.

lordbachus - 11 May 2015 02:58 AM

I dont think a website like motifator requires the sales to make profit, as many other popular websites make money by adding advertismens alone.... Not that its a bad thing they are selling this stuff as overall most of the prices sound pretty fair.

In order to better understand what Motifator is about, please see the second thread cmayhle linked to.

I would hate to see Motifator become a site supported strictly by ads. In fact, because the intrusion can be very annoying, I likely would no longer participate if that were to happen.

 

lordbachus -

I found some facebook pages that share some lovely stuff, however, i am wondering indeed how much stuff on there is illegally copied.

If you’re referring to what I think you are, then it has a high likelihood of being pirated commercial material.

 

lordbachus -

I was strictly talking about user created content from free sample libraries ( there are many high quallity ones). To patches and voices and arps that use the over 700 mb of content allready in the MOXF....

Still makes me feel a little sad, not being able to to share my selfcreated stuff with other likeminded…

By all means, sharing what you have truly created yourself should be encouraged. I’ve posted software, etc., of my own creation. I don’t tend to post Voices, Performances, and the like (other than those which I use to illustrate a programming technique), but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t.

I eagerly anticipate the posting of your first self-created MOXF sound. In order to avoid the possibility of accidentally passing on other’s work, you might want to use my All User Initialized.X3A file available here:
http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/viewthread/471009/

cmayhle - 11 May 2015 03:27 AM

lordbachus - 11 May 2015 02:58 AM

...I dont think a website like motifator requires the sales to make profit, as many other popular websites make money by adding advertismens alone.... Not that its a bad thing they are selling this stuff as overall most of the prices sound pretty fair....

There is nobody stopping people from sharing original VOICE or PERFORMANCE work at this Forum.

For example, you will find some excellent work offered Here.

However, if you think that this site does not need to sell products to keep it solvent and functioning, you might be interested in what MrMotif has to say Here.

I can fully understand MrMotifs pov from a commercial stand..
And there is nothing wrong with that as he is the owner of the website and paying the bills

So while this is a good website for finding and asking information,
This is obviously not the place to share things
as MrMotif generously explains.

lordbachus - 09 May 2015 11:42 PM

stein67 - 07 May 2015 04:19 PM

This is a loooonnnngggg shot.  Just wondered if there was a site anywhere that had guides for setting up performances for a gigging keyboard player?

While programming your own sounds is allways fun and good to learn, there is also something called a community to help eachother..

Just tell me the difference between sharing other peoples music on stage and using pre programmed sounds?

I think having a community of people that share the things they have created freely ober the web would be a good thing. People helping eachother would be an even better thing. Now if you said, now let me help you with creating those sounds would be something different. But all you said is ....  Just do it yourself, and if you can’t you are a fail..

People not able to share, and asking money for everything they do, like creating guides or for sharing the stuff they made are the bane of todays community… In days long passed when minstrells and bards met on the road, they spend days together teaching eachother their songs and mellodies. Thats how music survived in those days, and thats what made musicians the core of the social society…

Many of us wandered off way to far from this road....

There is nothing wrong in sharing Dave.... Its a wonderfull thing knowing you have helped someone...and if you dont want to share your patches atleast tell him how to create his own patches…

This is where the head scratching began. What does any of this have to do with the original topic or Dave’s response, for that matter?  The topic is performances. No one mentioned voices(patches?) or the sharing of them.

stein67 - 07 May 2015 04:19 PM

This is a loooonnnngggg shot.  Just wondered if there was a site anywhere that had guides for setting up performances for a gigging keyboard player?

Not that I’m aware of. Splits and layers are a personal thing.

While the thought has merit, the execution would be difficult. So much comes into play it would require some intense one on one to set up performances for any particular player. Every players situation is different and requires a fairly custom set-up. I’ve prepared performances for others but only after receiving explicit directions and this still results in a continued back and forth discussion. I’ve found performances set up in some libraries. Nice idea but how could the programmer know my needs?  Maybe I don’t want the strings on the left but rather the right. Edit city. Don’t need horns, I have my own section. I play 2 or 3 boards. On and on.

Dave’s right, you just get after it. Rest assured, if you have any problems you can get help here.

Stone

stoneb3 - 11 May 2015 10:08 AM

lordbachus - 09 May 2015 11:42 PM

stein67 - 07 May 2015 04:19 PM

This is a loooonnnngggg shot.  Just wondered if there was a site anywhere that had guides for setting up performances for a gigging keyboard player?

While programming your own sounds is allways fun and good to learn, there is also something called a community to help eachother..

Just tell me the difference between sharing other peoples music on stage and using pre programmed sounds?

I think having a community of people that share the things they have created freely ober the web would be a good thing. People helping eachother would be an even better thing. Now if you said, now let me help you with creating those sounds would be something different. But all you said is ....  Just do it yourself, and if you can’t you are a fail..

People not able to share, and asking money for everything they do, like creating guides or for sharing the stuff they made are the bane of todays community… In days long passed when minstrells and bards met on the road, they spend days together teaching eachother their songs and mellodies. Thats how music survived in those days, and thats what made musicians the core of the social society…

Many of us wandered off way to far from this road....

There is nothing wrong in sharing Dave.... Its a wonderfull thing knowing you have helped someone...and if you dont want to share your patches atleast tell him how to create his own patches…

This is where the head scratching began. What does any of this have to do with the original topic or Dave’s response, for that matter?  The topic is performances. No one mentioned voices(patches?) or the sharing of them.

Well, for one, dave started about sounds, which is an equivalent to voices and not to performances..

DavePolich - 07 May 2015 08:59 PM

Programming your sounds is part of your job as a keyboard player.You’ll always learn something new while doing it, and the better you get at it, the less time it will take, and
eventually you won’t have to go looking for the sounds you need because you will be able to make them yourself.

And thats where my reaction comes from....  And in the end, the orriginal question was about sharing things, as was the rest of the topic....  I really dont see why you had to attack me on this one…

lordbachus - 11 May 2015 02:22 PM

And thats where my reaction comes from....  And in the end, the orriginal question was about sharing things, as was the rest of the topic....  I really dont see why you had to attack me on this one…

Attack? Really?  I made a point and stand by it.

Please quote stein67’s use of the word share, maybe tie it in with the word sounds. I can’t find it now, nor could I yesterday when I tried to understand the relevance of your post to the thread. If anyone has been attacked its been Dave and the Forum as a whole. We don’t share here?  Advice: yes. Experience: yes. Even yet, sounds: yes. And yes, sales from the shop support the site and help us to help others. It’s your choice to participate.

You’ve hijacked this thread for who knows why and not contributed one bit to stein67’s situation. At this point I’d gather he’s fairly frustrated and disgusted. Thanks for the input.

psychobabble - 11 May 2015 07:53 PM

Someone disagreed with you on the internet lordbachus so it MUST be an attack!

lordbachus - 09 May 2015 11:42 PM

Just tell me the difference between sharing other peoples music on stage and using pre programmed sounds?

When you *share* other people’s music on stage by playing it, the venue will be licensed and pay fees to a performance rights organization.

I am going to answer that with a question…

What is the difference between free to play games and games you have to pay for on your mobile device?

And whats the difference between offering something for free (like music or samples, or sounds or performance) and asking money for them?

I can tell you that not everything in this world is licensed..  So if someone decides to share something for free, it is entirely his own choice..

There is however and thats where you have a point, a huge difference between sharing things for free, and copying things, when you share things you are not allowed to share freely on stage, you are not sharing but copying witouth autorization. Your example is nothing but paying for copying someone others work.

But when someone freely shares something with the community, it is free to use.

And from a lawyers point of view, how much do you get payed when someone uses a sound that you created on stage? I admit that you have a point, but this one will never hold under current laws.

But we should leave it at that, where i am being attacked for high jacking this post, this will even derail the discussion further from the original topic.

The topic starter wants to know, if there is anyone freely sharing his hard work with this world… and so far i have learned that such is not a common thing on motifator and its even frowned uppon by the owners of this website, because it does cost them money. So my conclusion is that this is not the place to ask such a question and even less a place to find the answers he wants.

lordbachus - 12 May 2015 12:34 AM

[...]
There is however and thats where you have a point, a huge difference between sharing things for free, and copying things, when you share things you are not allowed to share freely on stage, you are not sharing but copying witouth autorization. Your example is nothing but paying for copying someone others work.

But when someone freely shares something with the community, it is free to use.
[...]
The topic starter wants to know, if there is anyone freely sharing his hard work with this world… and so far i have learned that such is not a common thing on motifator and its even frowned uppon by the owners of this website, because it does cost them money. So my conclusion is that this is not the place to ask such a question and even less a place to find the answers he wants.

What you are failing to understand or acknowledge is that a high percentage of the sites where “sharing” occurs are making pirated material available. That includes sites which claim the contents are “self-made”, but are often offering commercial libraries, sometimes renamed or slightly edited.

As I’ve said previously, it takes considerable effort to create useful original Motif Voices, or even Performances. Making your efforts available to others, as long as they are original (if a Performance, Voices should not be from third-party commercial libraries), shouldn’t be discouraged. Since you apparently would agree with that, please demonstrate the strength of your convictions by posting just one of your own creations.

As with most things in life, and certainly with things musical, it’s all about balance.

All the people who’ve contributed to this thread have made valid points and observations. In an ideal world we would not have to scramble like crazy just to stay afloat but that is our reality and we accept that and try to do everything we can to keep Motifator fair, fun and, well, most importantly, open.

This is increasingly not easy. Fortunately, Mr Motif (that would be me) also spends his time writing books, making videos, doing live events amongst other stuff which all goes to support the continued appearance of Motifator.com.

To be clear on the ‘sharing’ question. We have never ‘stopped’ anyone sharing anything on Motifator. There are some, who, through some wonderful piece of financial good fortune, appear not to need to paying for creating bucket loads of new Motif material. We only ‘ask’ they ease back on the gas a little when it comes to actively and continually ‘promoting’ their free material because then, quite frankly, they’re behaving like a commercial entity even though the currency may be glory, heaped praise, a deep commitment to pro bono or who knows what. Whatever it is, there is a line between accepting that free data needs to be a part of the general fabric of life on Motifator and having free data shoved where the sun would appear not to shine so much. Especially since we are paying for said free data to be hosted and posted!

Dave Polich’s point is also well made and true. And he is a professional programmer so he could be forgiven for taking the complete opposite point of view (hey, don’t waste time making your own stuff, folks, come buy mine!). Voice programming is a real skill, though, and I challenge anyone here to program Voices of the quality of a DCP library at a better per-hour rate. $30-$40 for 128 or more Voices? It would take me a month to make that number and still most of them would be c*^$. So, unless you like working for about 10 cents an hour…

However, and especially when it comes to things like Performances, which after all are essentially manifestations of Voice combinations, maybe with arpeggios, there are sound reasons why rolling your own should be encouraged. For starters, Performances only store Voice location information. So if your Bank 4 Voice number 87 is a harpsichord and mine is a bagpipe, it’s safe to say that any Performance that flags Bank 4 Voice number 87 is not going to be universally useful. Secondly, how do I (potential Performance programmer) know where you want the split in a piano-bass combo? Or what tempo of groove you like playing the blues at? These are things that are not terribly difficult to set up and, as Dave says, will get less difficult with each passing patch. One might even ask if you’re not even capable of setting up your own Performances… well, you get the picture I hope. Be brave! Get stuck in!

Going back to the general question of sharing, one thing I did float in the thread linked earlier was the subscription model. Again, this may be a good thread for people to voice what they might like or dislike about this.

If Motifator was financed by a modest annual subscription, then that would remove the need for library and other product sales or increased ads to keep the site going. I think it reasonable to imagine that in such a scenario, even the most aggressive sharers (provided they were still legal owners of course) would not cause any concern whatsoever.

Motifator.com has been around for longer than Facebook, or Twitter, or Youtube. I’m not sure if that’s something to be proud or ashamed of, but with everyone’s support - and not just financial - hopefully we will make our 15th or even 20th anniversary in due course.

MM