Mozart , Chopin, Brahms , Chajkovski and all the greatest composers of ALL times never needed technology. Today with all that technology nobody can even get close to what they composed. Why? Because new beautiful music comes to the mind that is attuned with nature and universe and for this you need to be in a peaceful state of mind and you need to play instrument many hours a day so you become one with it.
Technology takes that peace away , you spent 10% playing ,90% steering at the screen , it’s like watching tv all day long or playing computer games , you don’t grow doing that you become damn. It stresses ou out, frustrates you and takes all your playing time away… At the end you have shadows under your eyes and you composition sucks , but by this time you can get a job at a computer store ...and sell instruments but forget playing them :)
That’s just my opinion

Chopin123, I get your frustration.  I really do.  But...if you are not able to walk the line between using technology to your benefit, yet not let it dominate and control your creativity, perhaps you should sell your XF and purchase a regular piano.

Yes, the XF is a complex instrument, and yes, it will require time and effort to become master of the technology instead of having it master you.  But if that is not a viable bargain to you, then perhaps you should consider another solution.

Opinions actually belong in the Mo Lounge - that’s what that section of this forum is for.

But that said, ummm, Yamaha wasn’t around when Mozart was alive. If the great classical composers had had today’s technology available, they would have used it. Because all of today’s composers do, to some degree. That includes creating arrangements on computers first before transcribing them to sheet music for the “real” orchestra to play.

Mozart actually was very much into “hi tech”. The orchestra was basically a new concept, with new advancements in instruments (such as valve horns, valve reeds, and new forms of keyboards) being the “new tools”. Mozart actually did a lot of “thinking outside the box” and came up with new ideas for instrumentation and composing
that hadn’t been attempted before. One of his favorite methods was to re-assign instrument parts to instruments that wouldn’t “normally” play those parts.

But we get it - you’re frustrated, and pissed because you can’t figure things out fast enough.

I have classical grand piano , I have not played it for several weeks since I bought motif.
If they want to try to help musicians then the keyboard needs to be simple. I think the only who can use this machine to its limits is the one that built it. I bet people will own that thing for 10 years and won’t even know about some options.

Chopin123 - 13 February 2013 04:49 PM

...I bet people will own that thing for 10 years and won’t even know about some options.

I am 100% sure that for many people this is absolutely true.  However, is that a bad thing really?

Chopin123 - 13 February 2013 04:49 PM

I have classical grand piano , I have not played it for several weeks since I bought motif.
If they want to try to help musicians then the keyboard needs to be simple. I think the only who can use this machine to its limits is the one that built it. I bet people will own that thing for 10 years and won’t even know about some options.

There are two types of creating music with synthesizers:

You play patches out of the box and let them dictate your music.
Or you write/ arrange your music first, and play it then on the synthesizer with the choices you made also regarding sounds

Although, the Motif can be a fantastic inspiration tool.

Hey first of all thanks for your response Yes , I’ve done both including music I composed long time ago on classical piano.
Overall outcome is really great . And it’s true selecting performance mode first and then making music into it can be very inspiring and makes you improvise.pretty cool.
I just got stuck with editing, running out of memory and all that. This is my first synthesizer or music work station ever, I’ve been trained as a classical piano player and played only acoustic pianos.i play jazz as well And I need to record some music so I bought motif. I’ve had it for 2 months only.everything in it is new to me.

Btw. When you said letting patches dictate you music, you meant playing in performance mode or something else?

This is my experience with technique vs. technology and the benefits and importance of synthesizers and electronics to a classical musician.

As an introduction, I think many of us who are not full time musicians are challenged between spending our limited time on perfecting playing skills verses learning the technology of our electronic instruments and how to record on a computer.

I have owed synthesizers since they were first sold in professional music stores when before volume sensitivity existed if you hit a wrong note there was no way to turn it into a passing tone. I also studied classical piano from childhood up until my first year of law school when there just wasn’t the time to practice and keep up. So with the frustrations of always playing badly, I decided to give it up and I spent more time studying jazz, where there is room for improvisation, and learning how to use all facets of my synthesizers. No regrets. 

But recently I decided to go back to my roots and spend some time studying classical piano again.  Here is what I could never have accomplished without technology, given the time I have to devote to music.

On day while improvising on my Yamaha C-7, I improvised a great concerto sounding piece and immediately recorded it on tape, which was a good idea because later I could not duplicate it by memory. So to try to figure out what I played, I slowed the tape way down (my unit has the ability), took it over to my XS8 (at the time), did the best I could to play what I heard from the tape into a midi track in song mode, loaded the midi track song into Logic and in Logic eventually edited the notes, timing and L.H. chords to where it was close.  But then I wanted to be able to play the song at the piano and needed sheet music. So I used Logic to produce the sheet music with the click of a key. There is no way I, personally, could have ever done that without today’s technology.

Here is another way I use technology to study piano.  I live near the ocean and with salt air rusting everything I have to keep the piano lid closed and the strings covered with a wool blanket to prevent rusting. This means every time I want to practice and use sheet music I have to lift up the front of the lid and prop up the music stand. It’s a nuisance and discourages playing.

But with technology I no longer have to lift the lid or even use paper sheet music. First, I scanned most of my former classical sheet music into pdf files, “added” those files to my iPad app, “forScore”, bought an Airturn pedal (set on the floor and turns pages via bluetooth with a foot tap) and now read the sheet music from the iPad supported vertically in an iPad stand sitting on top of the closed grand piano lid on a cloth so not to scratch the piano. No more lifting the piano lid, books to set up or lug around, no longer slowing down to turn pages by hand and no more trying to get a light to shine evenly on the sheet music and piano keys at the same time because the iPad is back lit.

For me, I enjoy playing the acoustic piano more than my XF8, but I also love to sit down at the XF8, have fun, record some tracks in performance record mode, sound like a full orchestra, sound like a rapper, etc. You can’t do this on a piano. But on the other hand, on a synthesizer you can’t convey the feelings coming through you as you can on an acoustic instrument. For me there is a place for the piano and a place for my synthesizers. I wouldn’t want to be without either.

Chopin123 - 13 February 2013 08:55 PM

Hey first of all thanks for your response Yes , I’ve done both including music I composed long time ago on classical piano.
Overall outcome is really great . And it’s true selecting performance mode first and then making music into it can be very inspiring and makes you improvise.pretty cool.
I just got stuck with editing, running out of memory and all that. This is my first synthesizer or music work station ever, I’ve been trained as a classical piano player and played only acoustic pianos.i play jazz as well And I need to record some music so I bought motif. I’ve had it for 2 months only.everything in it is new to me.

Btw. When you said letting patches dictate you music, you meant playing in performance mode or something else?

The mode is not important, although the performance one is really for playing and stacking several layers/ instruments at once.
It takes time indeed to learn the structure of the motif but in the end it pays off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyLDprZ4qlE
for example Hans Zimmer! Full of technology and music compositions at least live together!...and many other composers ,they use technology every day!I think after many years from now we will know who is the “mozart” and the “beethoven” of our time! The Beatles used technology back in the 60’s and they are already “classics” now!

Hi Mercedes
Thanks for your reply
I totally agree , you can’t replace acoustic piano with motif or vice versa , you need both to manage music these days. The great thing on motif is that when you enter that state of the mind when you have no thoughts and your fingers have courage to move to totally unknown areas for new music you can just press the record button and all will be saved.Then you can print out the notes. This is very important because if you want to be able to repeat that on acoustic piano you would have to stop go back and see what you just played, and when you do it you start thinking and you’re out of that state of mind.
And of course you can then build other instruments around it.....

Hi keramox
Thanks for your reply and video, it’s good to see What these guys have to say about composing in our times.
He had quite a lot of monitors there , uh! Is it helpful to have all these monitors?
One of my favorite composers of our times is Vangelis. I don’t know what he used these days , but most of his career he was using analog keyboards and many of them, he was achieving such great sounds!but I guess that’s a totally different coockie.....

Chopin123 - 14 February 2013 03:02 AM

Hi keramox
Thanks for your reply and video, it’s good to see What these guys have to say about composing in our times.
He had quite a lot of monitors there , uh! Is it helpful to have all these monitors?
One of my favorite composers of our times is Vangelis. I don’t know what he used these days , but most of his career he was using analog keyboards and many of them, he was achieving such great sounds!but I guess that’s a totally different coockie.....

Hi. Vangelis is a great example of someone using several synthesizers of his time, notably the Yamaha CS 80, and achieved a sound with it unknown before. (Bladerunner for example).

really??? Most of those composers you mention really suck - who is listening to them today???  Are you listening to Mozart? hell no,
I can tolerate maybe 2 pieces of him and not everyday although I started
playing piano with some of his work.

Would you rather go to Mozart concert or Peter Gabriel???  come on be honest…

p.s.
one exception is Chopin probably, I can listen and play this guys music all day long…

Hey Delirium
Ok.ill be honest .Mazart is boring very predictable and organized, but Rahmaninoff, Brahms (check Hungarian dances),Chajkowski, Schostakovitch , Strauss and many others are geniuses !  . Give these a try:
http://youtu.be/M0U73NRSIkw
http://youtu.be/JJ47Tc4jDi0
http://youtu.be/8alxBofd_eQ
http://youtu.be/DgYhcM5TB_c

Chopin123 - 13 February 2013 04:31 PM

Mozart , Chopin, Brahms , Chajkovski and all the greatest composers of ALL times never needed technology. Today with all that technology nobody can even get close to what they composed. Why? Because new beautiful music comes to the mind that is attuned with nature and universe and for this you need to be in a peaceful state of mind and you need to play instrument many hours a day so you become one with it.
Technology takes that peace away , you spent 10% playing ,90% steering at the screen , it’s like watching tv all day long or playing computer games , you don’t grow doing that you become damn. It stresses ou out, frustrates you and takes all your playing time away… At the end you have shadows under your eyes and you composition sucks , but by this time you can get a job at a computer store ...and sell instruments but forget playing them :)
That’s just my opinion

because in that time they did not have Motif XF with a couple of mbs ROM piano, with 3 velocity leyers and alot of looping and compression, and mp3 cruppy format They had high quality pianos which sounded out of this world. So that’s why thouse people we are inspired by trually high quality instruments and created master pices

p.s. If they had Motif Xf there instid, brobably thouse people would waite for the next Yamaha refrash and see if it sounds like a real piano, and if it not, then they would waite again for a couple of years more, and then they probably would die from waiting…