Old Motifator threads are available in the Archive.
keyrunner
Total Posts: 56
Joined 01-28-2011 status: Experienced |
I have a motif XF for about four months and, for various reasons, I was not ever use it with headphones.
At first, I immediately noticed a high amount of noise on the tails of some sounds, but using these sounds some samples, I thought that the noise resulted from a lack of care at sampling procedure ... (but since these were derived from emblazoned libraries doubt that the problem was for all that). Then when editing a voice which only uses internal sample (an E. Piano), I heard the terrible noise of passing alternately from right to left in a circularly continuous way. I have disabled all insertion and master effects but the noise still remains..
I have immediately recognized the type of noise and I have realized that was not inherent in the sample itself but was due to the development of the calculation.
As evidence of this, just change the type of waveform to hear the LFO to change the size of the defect.
Result ... a disaster!
The motif XF is a beautiful instrument, but as to this aspect the YAMAHA programmers have really failed ...
I hope that in the next update (hopefully in the short term) Yamaha put his hand in other things and also in this annoying problem .... I apologize for my bad english so I do not want to offend anyone.. Keyrunner |
delirium
Total Posts: 2441
Joined 11-16-2006 status: Guru |
get motif XS. |
5pinDIN
Total Posts: 11891
Joined 09-16-2010 status: Legend |
Please list some specific Voices from Preset (not User) banks that exhibit what you are hearing.
See my post in this thread: http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/index.php/viewthread/453929/ |
youdog
Total Posts: 482
Joined 01-31-2009 status: Enthusiast |
Don’t worry! Yamaha will teach you how to hear the motif xf correctly. They will not fix this with a update you must learn how to hear noise as a part of music. Do you how the flash board in? If so take it out and see do you still hear this noise.
Do you hear this noise on all sounds?
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keyrunner
Total Posts: 56
Joined 01-28-2011 status: Experienced |
Thank you all for the answers .. Unfortunately now I’m at work and do not have access to my XF.
What I can say with confidence is that the voice mentioned above in reference to the defect created by the lack of resolution of the controllers and the LFO, is composed of only elements present in rom.
Waiting for a reply from an official Yamaha source with the hope that is not of the kind indicated by youdog .. “Do not worry! Yamaha will teach you how to hear the motif xf Correctly. They will not fix this with a update you must learn how to hear noise as a part of music.” I just heard this kind of bad marketing communications a lot of times and no one believes more!!! A strong man is one who can admit when he make mistakes .. I think the same thing for a reputable firm ... As soon as I can I will do other tests on xf although I think that there is a solution to this problem if not reprogramming the firmware (if the hardware used permits..), I’m really sad!
for delirium:
ciao keyrunner |
dcool
Total Posts: 426
Joined 11-01-2006 status: Enthusiast |
maybe you have a defect unit, take the @youdog advise..go to your music store with your headphones and listen if it’s the same issue.
Good luck,
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keyrunner
Total Posts: 56
Joined 01-28-2011 status: Experienced |
Yes I’ll go to the music store as soon as possible hoping they have others units on the floor..
ciao
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youdog
Total Posts: 482
Joined 01-31-2009 status: Enthusiast |
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5pinDIN
Total Posts: 11891
Joined 09-16-2010 status: Legend |
Based on your description, I suspect you are referring to Pre1 B06 (Vintage ‘74), or possibly B15 (Vintage Phase). I’ve been unable to verify what you are experiencing audibly on my own XS6 with those two voices. (If it’s a different voice, please be specific.) I even looked at the main analog outputs via an oscilloscope, with the gain turned up so that low-level waveforms could be easily seen, and just saw the normal amplitude decay (no obvious artifacts). Assuming I’ve been inspecting the correct voice, that suggests either the problem is only present on an XF, or (as has been already suggested by others) is due to a defect in your particular unit. Equipment that has both digital and analog circuitry is usually designed so that one can’t adversely affect the other. Digital and analog power supply and ground connections are separated in order to minimize possible impact. However, things can go wrong that would allow digital noise/artifacts to get into the analog section. I agree with the others who’ve suggested that you listen to another XF with your headphones and see if the same thing that you’ve mentioned can be heard. Please let us know what you determine. |
dfahrner
Total Posts: 67
Joined 03-10-2009 status: Experienced |
For me, it never works to edit voices using headphones, no matter how good/expensive they are - things just never sound the same through speakers (again, no matter how good/expensive they are)...conversely, editing through a good, flat-response studio monitor always results in voices that sound good through any reasonable-quality sound reproduction system, and headphones, too...is it that the headphone aural environment is just too different from sound moving in free air? Maybe it’s just my ears… df |
DavePolich
Total Posts: 6820
Joined 07-27-2002 status: Guru |
It may be Keyrunner’s particular XF, his particular set of headphones, or it may be Keyrunner’s hearing itself that is the problem.
I’m not hearing anything like what Keyrunner has complained about on the
Yamaha engineers are some of the most experienced engineers in the world.
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5pinDIN
Total Posts: 11891
Joined 09-16-2010 status: Legend |
That’s encouraging, but it doesn’t eliminate the possibility that other XF units have a problem. Sometimes trouble creeps into production that affect a few (or even many) units, but isn’t noticed by QC because it’s subtle.
While I do believe that Yamaha engineering is of high quality, nobody is perfect. I’ve worked in audio electronics for more than double your 20 year experience with Yamaha, and have seen more than I like of questionable engineering design and programming—including some by Yamaha, on gear that I personally own. Although the problem that keyrunner is experiencing may indeed be unique to his particular XF or circumstances, I’m inclined to withhold judgment until more information is available. Now, if Yamaha wants to provide an XF to me so that I can run it through my lab and determine for sure whether there’s a problem… :-) |
keyrunner
Total Posts: 56
Joined 01-28-2011 status: Experienced |
Ok friends,
I’m sorry to have created a mixed reaction, as I wrote earlier I do not want to offend anyone’s reputation but just try to understand ... the fact remains that I am a little dismayed by the situation.
well ..
Here i’ve found a Motif XF8.
I asked politely if we could record the test so as to be able to document what I speak about, and he has consented to lending the equipment available at the moment..
so..
I have trimmered the volume without gain in the H4n, and I ave raised the level of XF at about half of the volume, (at the maximum level a distortion occours on h4n also at minimum gain settings.. so...) The Headphones used (My Headphones)are AKG K271 MKII. To avoid every suspect I have initialized a voice from stratch. Then I’ve set only one element with the follow waveform: PRE/kb/Rd/0148 EP1SW. I’ve turned off all kind of effects (Insertion, System and Master). Then I’ve played a note (C) one octave above the middle C I have also previously selected page: COMMON EDIT / Common LFO / Set / parameter 2 = pan, value 0 Immediately after playing the first note (medium speed), I turned the dial to bring the value of the parameter on pan 127.
the result can be heared in the atached file..
One last thing, the test was done with and without flash installed with the same result. Waiting for comments on this .. Thanks to all ciao keyrunner |
keyrunner
Total Posts: 56
Joined 01-28-2011 status: Experienced |
I apologize but I find some problems to upload the file.wav.. everything seems to be ok but I’n unable to see my file correctly uploaded… I try again.... mybe I’ve to convert it to mp3 at good quality compression… Keyrunner File Attachments
STE-001.mp3 (File Size: 906KB - Downloads: 982) |
5pinDIN
Total Posts: 11891
Joined 09-16-2010 status: Legend |
I could joke about how quiet the file sounds… ...but seriously, I don’t see any attached file. EDIT: Okay, I got the MP3, and the stepping/zipper-noise is obvious. I’ll see if I can duplicate it on my XS. |
5pinDIN
Total Posts: 11891
Joined 09-16-2010 status: Legend |
I set up my XS with an initialized voice, programmed as above (except that EP1 Sw is waveform 0049 on the XS). The result was… the same noise as heard in the posted recording of the XF, and the ‘scope shows obvious stepping of the amplitude envelope.
Old joke --
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