Just a quick follow up Bad Mister....

I was able to load everything fine, but when the power is turned off, only certain voices are saved, while others will display but will not play.

Up to this point, I have not used the STORE function.  Is this my problem, and if so, how is used?

Thanks,
Mitch

videoman123 - 06 July 2011 11:04 PM

Just a quick follow up Bad Mister....

I was able to load everything fine, but when the power is turned off, only certain voices are saved, while others will display but will not play.

Up to this point, I have not used the STORE function.  Is this my problem, and if so, how is used?

Thanks,
Mitch

Hi Mitch,
Just so you know and understand, that those new voices and wave patterns must be reloaded each time you power up, or the flash module will have to be on your shopping list. It’s just how they work, with the onboard 128…
That way, you’ll only have to do this once, you load and store all those new voices & they will be ready to play upon start up, every time you power up the Motif.

It’s not all that difficult to load them from your thumb drive, until you buy a flash memory board.
I’d advise the FL1024, that way you will have some room to move.
Or buy two FL512… available from Keyfax Store.

Have fun

Chas

Thanks Chas...Now I understand!

Best,
Mitch

videoman123 - 06 July 2011 11:04 PM

[...]Up to this point, I have not used the STORE function.  Is this my problem, and if so, how is used?

I’m glad you were able to resolve the “Inspiration In A Flash” Voice and Bank loading problems. As I believe you now understand, SDRAM is “volatile” memory—data loaded to it will be lost when the power is turned off. Flash memory is “non-volatile”, and retains data even when there’s no power.

Perhaps I can help with understanding when STORE is needed. I suggest that you look at the Memory Structure diagram on page 35 of the XF Reference Manual. You’ll notice that besides the memory used for samples (SDRAM and/or the optional Flash Modules), there’s also Flash ROM. In order for things listed in the left-hand column to be retained in the Flash ROM, they must be STOREd, as the diagram indicates. The diagram also shows, in the right-hand column, which file types (by their extensions) can be loaded into the different kinds of memory in the XF.

I hope that clarifies things a bit.

Very clear now 5pinDIN. 

Thanks,
Mitch

5pinDIN - 07 July 2011 01:10 AM

...I suggest that you look at the Memory Structure diagram on page 35 of the XF Reference Manual. You’ll notice that besides the memory used for samples (SDRAM and/or the optional Flash Modules), there’s also Flash ROM. In order for things listed in the left-hand column to be retained in the Flash ROM, they must be STOREd, as the diagram indicates. The diagram also shows, in the right-hand column, which file types (by their extensions) can be loaded into the different kinds of memory in the XF.

I hope that clarifies things a bit.

Hi 5pinDIN and thanks for your valuable contributions to this forum!

I could not understand one thing in the diagram. There’s a thick arrow pointing from ’File extensions “.WAV” & “.AIF”‘ in the right-hand column to ’User Voice (Normal, Drum)‘ under Flash ROM in the middle column. What does it signify? I don’t think we can LOAD .WAV or .AIF from USB/Computer drive to the User Flash ROM? Just what does this pointer mean?

Regards,
Vikas

VikasSharma - 07 July 2011 11:27 AM

Hi 5pinDIN and thanks for your valuable contributions to this forum!

You’re welcome, Vikas, and I’m glad that you participate as well.
.

I could not understand one thing in the diagram. There’s a thick arrow pointing from ’File extensions “.WAV” & “.AIF”‘ in the right-hand column to ’User Voice (Normal, Drum)‘ under Flash ROM in the middle column. What does it signify? I don’t think we can LOAD .WAV or .AIF from USB/Computer drive to the User Flash ROM? Just what does this pointer mean?

Hmmm, that’s a good question.  As you suggest, audio sample data can’t be loaded to User Flash ROM. However, there’s data other than just that of the audio sample in a .WAV or .AIF file. I believe what you’ve referred to in the diagram recognizes that additional information.

I found a few links that describe the file formats in some detail.
Basic .WAV info:
https://ccrma.stanford.edu/courses/422/projects/WaveFormat/
Detailed .WAV info:
http://www.sonicspot.com/guide/wavefiles.html
Basic .AIF info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_Interchange_File_Format

5pinDIN - 07 July 2011 12:31 PM

...there’s data other than just that of the audio sample in a .WAV or .AIF file. I believe what you’ve referred to in the diagram recognizes that additional information.

I found a few links that describe the file formats in some detail…

As you say, there’s a lot in the Wave file than just the Wave. The links that you’ve referred to provide quite detailed info regarding these two file formats. I’m, however, skeptical about the Motif recognizing all that additional info and then LOADing that info into the Flash ROM. What could be the info from within a WAV or AIF file that the synth would require to store there in order for it to be available across power cycles?

Anyways, thanks for your reply.

Regards,
Vikas

I, also, doubt that the Motif recognizes all that data. In fact, because many programs that write Wave files don’t strictly adhere to the standard, it would probably be a good idea to ignore all but what’s needed. I can tell you that various hardware/software deal with the files differently from manufacturer to manufacturer, and even product to product.

Perhaps Bad_Mister has some knowledge of the details, and will enlighten us.

The diagram is very accurate. Data with extensions .WAV or AIF can be LOADED by a USER VOICE either a Normal or Drum kit USER Voice. Notice the arrow is one-way. Indicating that it is LOAD (from a FILE to a USER VOICE).

The middle box of the diagram is labeled USER MEMORY. Your normal USER VOICE and your drum USER VOICE can load files with the extension .WAV or AIF, absolutely.

Go to VOICE mode
Press [FILE]
Select TYPE = WAV or AIF
Files with this extension can be accessed by USER VOICES no doubt about it.
It will ask you to what ELEMENT or KEY you want to load it

The USER Samples are housed (loaded) to SDRAM (as indicated at the bottom of the USER MEMORY block).

Notice how that center box (the containing the “User Voice (Normal, Drum)” is in the “Flash ROM” area of the USER MEMORY.

At the bottom of USER MEMORY is “SDRAM"… notice that this is where the WAVEFORM data goes.

When you power down, FLASH ROM is NOT lost (the USER Voice data from both the normal Voice and the drum kit Voice remain in memory… it is the SDRAM that is lost.

So there are two types of USER MEMORY:
Flash ROM (which remains) at the top of USER MEMORY
SDRAM (which is volatile) at the bottom of USER MEMORY

The diagram indicates what we all know:
Power down the VOICE parameters are still there. The Waveform (Sample data) is gone.

It is context sensitive: the File types on the right (indicated by their extensions) are listed next to modes that you can actually use to load the data
When you are in VOICE mode you notice that you cannot load a SONG, when you are in SONG mode you cannot load a PATTERN, when you are in PATTERN mode you cannot load a SONG. You have to be in SONG mode to load a SONG. You have to be in PATTERN mode to load a PATTERN.

When you are in VOICE mode you can load a VOICE, but you can also load a .WAV to a Voice, you can load an AIF to a VOICE. In fact a .WAV or .AIF must be loaded to some kind of USER VOICE, always. Be it a Normal User, Drum User or a USER VOICE assigned in the ISS (Integrated Sampling Sequencer). When in VOICE mode you can load data from an ALL VOICE (X3V) file or from a VOICE EDITOR file (X3E).

Even when you think are loading or sampling AUDIO to the sequencer… there is never, ever, ever anything but MIDI data on the track of a sequencer. The Tracks of the sequencer always contain MIDI data. That MIDI data always triggers a sample Voice, be it a PRESET VOICE (that always use Preset Waveforms), or a USER VOICE (that User Voice can be in the normal USER 1, 2, 3, 4 bank or in the Drum User bank, or a USER SAMPLE VOICE in the MIXING setup - but always the audio in contained in a VOICE.

When you sample or load .WAV or AIF it always is loaded to some kind of VOICE. Notice the word “Sampling” (lower left in the diagram) and how it points to both the USER VOICE and to the SDRAM’s Waveform.

Samples can be loaded to a USER VOICE (Normal and Drum). The actual audio data goes to SDRAM Waveform.

The diagram also indicates that files with the extensions .WAV and .AIF can be loaded/save directly to/from the FLASH BOARDS. And can be accessed by the AUDIO RECORD/PLAY feature

Thanks Bad_Mister, for such a lucid explanation of the diagram. Things are now much clearer than before.

It is always a pleasure reading the posts from you. I’ve learnt a lot (and many would agree with me) about this wonderful synth just by going through your articles/posts. I’d joined this forum a few weeks before buying my XF6 and, to be frank, one of the major reasons for my purchase decision was the excellent support platform that is Motifator. It is amazing to see people out here coming forward to share their views/experiences/tricks so eagerly with everyone but it is even more amazing to see all you guys from Yamaha/Keyfax directly interacting with the users at large and educating everyone for free in the process.

I really want to thank everyone at Yamaha/Keyfax for their unstinting support and especially you - the uncrowned king of Motifator.com.

Regards,
Vikas

Bad_Mister - 06 July 2011 05:32 PM

I followed your steps exactly as shown.  I even tried copying banks 1 -3.  Although they will copy all the sounds in the banks, some of them simply will not play any sound at all. 

Example… I copied Bank2 to USR Bank 2 and the following voices will not play any audio:  MMh Choir, Gopsel Velo, Live Scat, Live Dooh, Live Baah, Live Daoo, Power Grand, Jazz Grand. 

However, within the same bank, S700 & Ooh Choir & Pad, Brass Orch B1, Sax Section1 play just fine. 

The same type of inconsistency is happening with the other banks.

We are not clear how you exactly “copied” Bank 2 to USR 2.

If you mean you are attempting to LOAD data from a file into your Motif XF. You have certain parameters that you must direct. One of the keys to getting to a point where you understand the Load function is to recognize exactly what the process is doing.

I’ve learned long ago on this site that before we get involved with a dialog about why you are not successful, we have to know what your particular situation is. If you are not successful, then you do not have the exact same situation as the original poster on the thread, (and perhaps you think it applies to you when in fact the thread my not).

So for the record (and since you did not start your own thread) let’s go over what you have in terms of FL boards, where they are located, and what is on them at the time you attempting to LOAD Voices (you used the word copy) to different locations.

COPYING Voices does not involve FILE function as much as it involves the STORE function. So please give us details on exactly what your situation is and we’ll help you master this load/copy/move Voice data around thing…

well me too facing the same problem with loading voices from inspiration in a flash...some of the voices are functioning fine but on voices you cont cant hear anything.. whats the right way of loading voices on the user memory?? are there any parameters which have to be editted?? i’ve loaded the voiceon the internal user memory… voices like Mandolin trem, live scat, lives baah etc are not functioning… how to get these working???

Jeson

jesonf - 08 November 2011 04:16 PM

well me too facing the same problem with loading voices from inspiration in a flash...some of the voices are functioning fine but on voices you cont cant hear anything.. whats the right way of loading voices on the user memory?? are there any parameters which have to be editted?? i’ve loaded the voiceon the internal user memory… voices like Mandolin trem, live scat, lives baah etc are not functioning… how to get these working???
Jeson

Hi jesonf,
After saving the files from your computer and plugging your memory stick in the Motif XF:
In VOICE mode, When you look at the folders on your USB drive, and examine where the voices are located, all the New Factory voices are housed in USER bank one, the ‘markers’ for the downloaded voices from IIAF are marked as being in USER 2 USER 3 USER 4. But since the Motif 128 mgb sdram are only capable of temporariliy holding a limited capacity, you will have to choose 2, 3 or 4 and trial them one bank at a time.
The instructions are clearly defined above to do this, or simply trial a single or a few voices, in this thread.

Please post your own thread for further questions, should you have difficulties.

Chas

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