While on this topic, let me provide an XF-specific example to my question.

So, my goal is:
I would like to translate the following XF MIDI Parameter Change Table information to a Sys Ex Event that a midi even processor can use. (Because learning how to read this will allow me to both use an XF slider to control a Sys Ex parameter on a midi-device, and could allow a midi controller to control an XF parameter. Like a midi-equipped knobby synth.)

For the Normal Voice FEG attack level info found on P.138 of the XF Data List, I see:

Address: 42 ee 15
Size: 2
Data Range (HEX):
00-01 for MSB
00-7F for LSB

And, Midi Solutions Event Processor Plus Programmer states that “Sys Ex event be inputted in the form F0 … F7, using XX for X value, YY for Y value, V1-V8 for variables 1-8.”

However, I tried various ways of interpreting that but the MS Event Processor Programmer would deem it invalid.

dsetto - 12 February 2016 03:57 PM

[...]For the Normal Voice FEG attack level info found on P.138 of the XF Data List, I see:

I suspect we don’t have the same XF Data List. The most recent one is the “C” version (motifxf_en_dl_c0.pdf http://download.yamaha.com/file/52366), and I’m looking at page 142.

 

dsetto -

Address: 42 ee 15
Size: 2
Data Range (HEX):
00-01 for MSB
00-7F for LSB

And, Midi Solutions Event Processor Plus Programmer states that “Sys Ex event be inputted in the form F0 … F7, using XX for X value, YY for Y value, V1-V8 for variables 1-8.”

However, I tried various ways of interpreting that but the MS Event Processor Programmer would deem it invalid.

The Parameter Change information provides only address and data bytes. The rest of the message is found on page 125 (of the “C” Data list), under (3-5-3-1) NATIVE PARAMETER CHANGE, MODE CHANGE.

Resulting in:
F0 43 1n 7F 12 42 ee 15 MM LL F7
where…
n = device number, typically 0 (zero) for first device
ee = element number, 1~8 (00~07)
MM = MSB
LL = LSB

Example:
F0 43 10 7F 12 42 00 15 01 40 F7
will set Element 1 FEG Attack Level to +64

If you have a MIDI utility (for Windows, MIDI-OX is a good one), the above can be sent and you can watch the XF’s display change - assuming, of course, that level wasn’t already at +64. Change the next-to-last byte (40) in the message to a different value (max 7F), send it again, and watch the display.

For Mac users, http://www.snoize.com/ looks like it has a utility for playing with SysEx.

ok, wow. i’ll need some time to digest. it’s like i looked in a translation book to speak a foreign language, but then the native spoke back to me. and right over my head. but, i can do it.

i’ve always wrestled with that midi cable. or anything programming, really. which is why i’m such a fan of this forum & its instrument. with this forum & this instrument i’ve gotten past so many life-long self-imposed obstacles.

dsetto - 12 February 2016 07:13 PM

ok, wow. i’ll need some time to digest. it’s like i looked in a translation book to speak a foreign language, but then the native spoke back to me. and right over my head. but, i can do it.

i’ve always wrestled with that midi cable. or anything programming, really. which is why i’m such a fan of this forum & its instrument. with this forum & this instrument i’ve gotten past so many life-long self-imposed obstacles.

It’s not difficult (says the guy who’s worked with it for about 30 years).  :-)  No, really, once you understand a few basics, it’s not hard to work with MIDI SysEx.

One of the first things, if you’re not already familiar with it, is to become somewhat aware of hexadecimal, or “hex” for short - it’s base 16. The Data List has a chart for converting between decimal (base 10, the one we commonly use) and hexadecimal on page 123. For instance, in the example SysEx message the LSB byte “40” is in hex, which in decimal is “64”.

The SysEx header (beginning with F0) and footer (F7) for parameter change and mode change messages for the XF are always as given on page 125.

The rest is a matter of filling in the address and data bytes, as found in the Parameter Change tables. Often that’s fairly straightforward, although sometimes the Data List could be clearer, and there are occasional errors.

If you’re trying to do something with SysEx, I suggest experimenting with a SysEx utility such as the ones I previously mentioned. If a message doesn’t seem to work, make sure you’ve got all the bytes correct, and if you get stuck, post. Let us know what you’re trying to do, and what message you’re sending that isn’t getting the job done. It should be possible to figure out what the problem is.

Wow. Great stuff to chew on. It’s more involved than I imagined; but thanks for breaking it down. I can see there may be a light once I round the corner to the tunnel.
--
My question is:

Can something like a midi event processor remap a Motif XF slider to adjust a parameter on a different instrument (like a reface) that doesn’t have a CC number, but rather a NRPN?
For example, I move the XF slider, and it adjusts the reface’s filter attack, through its full range of values.

I believe it can, based on your 1st response. But what I don’t get is: in your last post’s specific example of a Sys Ex address, a specific value to the parameter was included - I believe. Just confirming what’s likely obvious, but I haven’t seen yet.

Please forgive my insistence.

--
Before I ask more, I’ll try to go learn about the basics of these topics.

Sys Ex, NRPN, Hexadecimal, CC

Thank you.

An event processor typically can remap one type of MIDI message to various others, and with proper programming accurately convey the data values.

What the MIDI Solutions models are capable of is covered to a decent degree here:
http://www.midisolutions.com/EP_EPP_User_Guide.pdf
If you have specific questions about their operation, they should probably be directed to , but I’ll be glad to help with questions about the Motif end of things.

If you want to learn about MIDI, this is an excellent source:
http://www.blitter.com/~russtopia/MIDI/~jglatt/

Thanks. The blitter site is what I needed. (My 1st pass on the midi solutions user guide was what informed me with enough sense to be able to go further into this thread.)

So glad to have been introduced to such a device.

Have a good weekend.

And here’s to more Motif XF topics!

might as well bookmark this here for when I get back to it!

Yamaha’s Hexadecimal to decimal value chart

dsetto - 18 February 2016 07:42 PM

might as well bookmark this here for when I get back to it!

Yamaha’s Hexadecimal to decimal value chart

Or see page 123 of the XF Data List (http://download.yamaha.com/file/52366).