I recently had my keyboard used in a small gig. Left it with the band and when I returned a 3 key cluster (C, C# & D) does not work. Structurally, they feel fine, however, pressing them produces no sound. The band said no one dropped it, however, on returning I noticed that they rearranged the stage slightly (guess no one owned up to dropping it). Any idea what may the problem and most importantly any solution (what parts I may need to check and/or replace). Not much information is online about this.

Note: I do not live in the US so getting it to an authorized repair center may be quite expensive.

wondering if a factory reset would help?

Which specific model?
Which C/C#/D?

Model: XF7
The keys affected are the C4 to D4 cluster.

Boardman - 27 January 2015 04:52 PM

Model: XF7
The keys affected are the C4 to D4 cluster.

Those keys have very little in common from an electronics standpoint. In fact, the C4 contacts are on a different board than the C#4 and D4 ones. The thing that they share the most is their physical proximity.

If no damage is detectable externally (such as uneven key heights, etc.), and the keys that don’t play feel the same as ones that are unaffected, then perhaps there’s been some kind of contamination, such as a liquid spilled onto the keyboard. Was the XF7 out of your possession for a significant period of time (minutes/hours/days)?

It would probably be a good idea to visually inspect the area of the problem. The XS7 and XF7 models use the same keyboard and other physical construction is the same. If you feel confident in your ability to investigate the problem, the Motif XS6/XS7/XS8 Service Manual can be found online. It includes disassembly instructions.

The keyboard was out of my safe keeping for about 48hrs. Do not know if you consider that significant but retrospectively now seems pretty significant to me (learnt my lesson of favoring convenience over longevity) . I played it briefly during that period though. It is only during the later half of that period that the malfunction was noticed.

Your explanation is very logical. No physical damage evident. I was searching online today for a service manual and was able to get the XS one. Was just about to ask if the designs of the two keyboards are similar and I saw your post.

I made an appointment with an electronics shop. I will first open and see if there is any contamination and then if no luck, drop it of at the shop with the manual for further analysis.

I will post my results ASAP. Thanks.

Boardman - 27 January 2015 11:30 PM

The keyboard was out of my safe keeping for about 48hrs. Do not know if you consider that significant but retrospectively now seems pretty significant to me (learnt my lesson of favoring convenience over longevity) . I played it briefly during that period though. It is only during the later half of that period that the malfunction was noticed.

That seems like an easily sufficient period of time for evidence of whatever happened to have been minimized.

 

Boardman -

Your explanation is very logical. No physical damage evident. I was searching online today for a service manual and was able to get the XS one. Was just about to ask if the designs of the two keyboards are similar and I saw your post.

I made an appointment with an electronics shop. I will first open and see if there is any contamination and then if no luck, drop it of at the shop with the manual for further analysis.

I will post my results ASAP. Thanks.

While there are definite differences between some of the electronics of the XS and XF, that won’t matter in this case. The problem with yours is local to the key contact area for the affected keys - due to the key scan circuit design, problems elsewhere would affect more than those three keys.

The FSX keyboards (the type found in the XS6/XS7/XF6/XF7) are not difficult to work on, and in many cases good mechanical skills are more important than knowledge of electronics. The trickiest part can be removal and proper reassembly of the keys in order to get to the contacts.

I recently returned from the electronics guy and I will try to explain what he said and what I saw. He said there is evidence of some slight spill in there and there are no mechanical problems. However, on the key switch (the rubbery stuff that makes contact with the PCB) the black stuff that actually makes contact PCB to play the note is somewhat eroded. He was able to get sound from the three keys (C4 to D4) cluster manually but not by directly pressing the keys.
Is there any way to get the part, i.e. the rubber switch?

http://syntaur.com/yamaha_motif.html

Check this site.  I got a new potentiometer last year for the XF’s pitch wheel.  It should be as simple as getting the new contact strip and reinstalling.  yah bless

Boardman - 31 January 2015 11:35 PM

I recently returned from the electronics guy and I will try to explain what he said and what I saw. He said there is evidence of some slight spill in there and there are no mechanical problems. However, on the key switch (the rubbery stuff that makes contact with the PCB) the black stuff that actually makes contact PCB to play the note is somewhat eroded. He was able to get sound from the three keys (C4 to D4) cluster manually but not by directly pressing the keys.
Is there any way to get the part, i.e. the rubber switch?

Yes, the rubber contact strip is available as a replacement part. See pages 204-205 of the XS Service Manual, parts labeled 215b and 210b. The part number given is WB168800, but that has been updated:

Yamaha #
WB16880R RUBBER CONTACT 12KEY $8.90(US, plus shipping charges)

You’ll need two of them, one for C#3~C4, and the other for C#4~C5.

Syntaur apparently has them at $10.95 each:
http://syntaur.com/Items/3457.html

As long as the contact areas on the printed circuits aren’t damaged and are gently cleaned, replacing the rubber contacts should fix the problem. It’s important that the rubber contacts be replaced carefully, using a paper clip as shown on page 29 of the Service Manual.

mikebengel - 01 February 2015 09:35 AM

http://syntaur.com/yamaha_motif.html

Check this site.  I got a new potentiometer last year for the XF’s pitch wheel.  It should be as simple as getting the new contact strip and reinstalling.  yah bless

Thanks, mikebengel. Will bookmark this site. May need it again.

5pinDIN, ordering now. Since I’m not in the US, I will have to get one of my friends to bring it when they are coming. May take a while before I reply to this thread. Anyway, sincere thanks for your assistance. Really appreciate your timely replies.

Boardman - 01 February 2015 03:49 PM

5pinDIN, ordering now. Since I’m not in the US, I will have to get one of my friends to bring it when they are coming. May take a while before I reply to this thread. Anyway, sincere thanks for your assistance. Really appreciate your timely replies.

You’re welcome.

By the way, although I didn’t pursue it very far, the syntaur site seems to show international shipping.

Just as an update, the problem is fixed. Fixed it a while but didn’t get around to posting. The contacts at the bottom of the rubber were erased for the three keys that weren’t working. As soon as the two affected strips were replaced, it worked perfectly. The only question that remain is what caused it. From the small particle of dusts that were around that area, it looked as if someone sanded the rubber contacts. The ended of one was even a bit rounded.  Don’t know if a liquid could do that. Anyway, I’m smiling again as the problem is solved. Could concentrate once more on playing. Thanks again.

Glad you’ve got things working properly again. Thanks for letting us know the outcome. I’ve never seen a spill cause the damage to the contacts that you just described - it seems more likely it was due to a repair attempt. When the contamination is minor, usually gentle cleaning with a cotton swab dampened with water (or at most some isopropyl alcohol) is sufficient - when not, more aggressive cleaning tends to make things worse, by removing the conductive carbon. In that case, replacing the damaged contacts is the best approach.